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Tuesday, October 20, 2009Death threats and precedentsThe Mariano Rivera stuff obviously struck a nerve today. For what it's worth, I stand by my posts on it, both here and at NBC. There was a video that showed something interesting. I raised some questions about it and doubted whether simply saying "Mariano would never do such a thing" was enough to put the kibosh on the inquiry. I qualified everything I said with statements about how the video was not conclusive and how better angles would be needed before something conclusive could be said. If there was an actual accusation in my comments somewhere, someone will have to point it out to me. MLB at least felt it necessary to take a quick look. When they did and weighed in later, I posted an update quite quickly. All in a day's bloggy work.But clearly not everyone agrees. Question: was it illegitimate to post links to the video and ask the questions I asked in the first place? I don't think so, but I'm curious for your thoughts. Not about Mariano -- that's over, and I'm quite content to accept MLB's view on it, especially in light of the still photos that appeared later in the day. I want to know whether it was wrong to even raise the issue in the first place, and if so, why so. The one reason people cited over and over today -- that it was Mariano Rivera we're talking about here, and he's not worthy of accusation -- doesn't convince me. If we had a picture of Mother Teresa raising a baseball bat over the head of a cowering man, would we not ask what was happening? The problem, it seems, only comes if you (a) immediately jump to a conclusion that she's beating the guy without acknowledging that more could be going on that first meets the eye; or (b) disregard actual, later evidence which debunks the first impression created by the picture. Two things lead me to ask these questions. First is the fact that I got a freakin' death threat over all of this. It's been deleted, but a commenter at NBC, after multiple posts in which he wished for me to die of horrible diseases, finally came out and said that he hoped someone killed me. Hey-o! I'm used to the Yankee nonsense I willingly stir up over there turning ugly, but this was beyond even my comfort level. There's no need to tell me that was uncalled for -- believe me, I know it -- but was this merely a moron at work, or was the post (which was nearly identical to the post below here) beyond my usual taunting? I honestly want your opinion. The second, and more substantial reason I ask is because I'm reminded of the Kenny Rogers affair from three years ago. You'll recall that cameras captured some schmutz on Rogers' hand. It disappeared an inning or two later. It was quickly looked into and then dismissed by MLB. In all of that, it was much like today's business. The difference: Mariano Rivera has a better reputation than Kenny Rogers, and no one thought to say that Kenny Rogers was above such questions. Was it legitimate to raise questions about Rogers and not Mariano? Was it legitimate or illegitimate for both? What are the rules here? Like I said, I think my posts were within the realm of the acceptable but obviously others disagree. Even those who don't want me dead. If you're all tired of this, move along. There's baseball happening. If not, though, I think it might be a worthy conversation to have in the comments. Posted by Craig Calcaterra at 4:36pm Comments
Ryan said...
Frank: i agree that media outlets, including blogs, often react too quickly, and often, irrationally. I will say though, that if acting quickly starts a conversation rather than reporting something just to report something, or reporting something for the drama, then it can be beneficial. And if anyone jumps the gun, it should be folks like Craig who use his [apparently crappy according to him] law/analytical background to further a discussion. Yeah, Craig was a little on the offense in this post, but i believe his contrarian explanation holds up. And as Bill B mentioned, I hope bloggers don’t stop asking questions. It’s what they do best, and is what mainstreamers do worst. Posted 10/20 at 06:27 PM
APBA Guy said...
Craig- We’ve known for a while the commenter gene pool at NBC has its share of anomalies, imagine what it’s going to be like when you are elected the first blogger President. I think it’s great that you raise these issues, and taking a side in the argument, regardless of which side, is a better way to stimulate discussion than trying to appear dead-even neutral. When you take a side, especially in the anonymous blogger world, there will be nut-jobs who agree with you and those who don’t, but hopefully a lot more non-nut-jobs reading and commenting because of what you do. Accentuate the positive: None of us on Shysterball have called for you to be guillotined. Just watch what you say about the A’s Posted 10/20 at 06:47 PM
DonCoburleone said...
Theif and Lair you missed Ted Williams age 38 season when he hit .388/.526/.731 (1.257OPS!). But theif you’re missing my point i think. I’m not saying every athlete over 36 who is still great is cheating. I’m saying that because of players like Mark McGwire, Barry Bonds and especially Roger Clemens we can no longer assume these guys are clean just because they’ve never been caught cheating in the past! If ANY kind of evidence of cheating comes forward regarding a player who is 40 and still the best in the world at what he does it should be taken extremely seriously. Even if that evidence is highly circumstantial. God it drives me nuts the way fans just assume certain players “could never do that” for no other reason than he seems like a good and honest person when he is interviewed by the media. Or because he was so nice to you or your son or whoever at some restaurant one time. Or because Mike Francesa says its blasphemy to put Mariano and cheating in the same sentence. I met Mark McGwire once back in 2002 and he was the nicest guy in the world. He gave me his autograph, he answered all my questions, he was polite. I loved him growing up, my absolute all time favorite player. I had posters of him in my room until I was 23 (sad I know). When all the steroid accusations came out (which to this day is nothing but circumstantial evidence) I didn’t scream blasphemy. I thought about it logically, and said yeah, you know what despite there being no REAL PROOF, i now consider him a cheater. So when some highly circumstantial evidence comes out suggesting that Mariano could be cheating YOU HAVE TO TAKE IT SERIOUSLY. I mean just say it out loud - A 40 year old who throws only 1 pitch is the best closer in the world. Would you really be shocked to find out that 40 year old was in some way cheating??? Posted 10/20 at 07:06 PM
Ron said...
You asked, you didn’t accuse. You didn’t create a story, you asked if there was one. Subtle differences, maybe, but well within the rights of bloggers. Posted 10/20 at 07:07 PM
Aaron Moreno said...
I read the “secret to the cutter” line, and considered it a sensationalist throwaway line. Didn’t consider for a second that you might believe it. Then again, I deal with lawyers more often than anyone should. Posted 10/20 at 07:10 PM
Kevin S. said...
Another Yankee fan here. I had absolutely no problem with how you treated it, Craig. I didn’t think you were ‘prosecuting’ Rivera at all. You consistently qualified your statements to reflect the inconclusiveness of what was there while giving your impressions on it. Well handled on your part, I believe. Posted 10/20 at 07:11 PM
Mode:Theif and Lair said...
Don, This is what I don’t like. Don is proving why wrongly accusing someone cannot be entirely “fixed” by giving evidence later that totally contradicts the earlier accusation. First of all, Rivera has never been accused of cheating. But after this optical illusion which put “spitball” and “Rivera” in the same sentence, and by inference (or implication whichever word is correct here) “cheating”, Don has a forum to question Rivera. If Don had made the same accusation yesterday without the now debunked “evidence” people would…. You know what, he wouldn’t even have made the accusation. But, I suppose (hope) time will wash this away and nobody will give it a second thought. Posted 10/20 at 07:37 PM
BillG said...
Aside from the “working for the prosecution” angle which you only seemed to do more casually than with intent, I feel that you reported this incident with the highest degree of accuracy and professionalism. And even with the fact that you do seem to argue (IMO, seemingly unintentionally) that he did doctor the ball that is a very minor infraction anyway. As for the low-life that threatened your well being, that’s just a disgusting low life that probably has the IQ of 4 year old who’s parent just took his favorite toy away. Keep up the good work Craig. Posted 10/20 at 07:46 PM
The Rabbit said...
Craig, as I’ve said about once a week, this is my favorite website and you are my favorite writer. Posted 10/20 at 08:24 PM
scatterbrian said...
Wow, Craig, that is pretty nuts. I’ve recently made an effort to limit my comment-reading on a lot of sites, but for whatever reason I have been sucked in to the NBC comments. Some are funny, some are just fanboy ridiculousness. But they do entertain. The more we learn about pro athletes—through the Mitchell Report and PED suspensions, the police blotter, cell phone cameras, Twitter posts, etc.—the more I realize these guys are fallible human beings who are not morally or ethically better than “normal” people. I think I’ve always known this, this recent phenomenon backs that up. What this illustrates is absolutely no one—including Mariano Rivera—should be given a pass on anything. Sure, they should still be considered innocent until proven otherwise, but that does not mean they are above scrutiny. In other words Craig, you were doing exactly what a responsible baseball blogger is supposed to do. Posted 10/20 at 08:55 PM
Jim Casey said...
Death threat eh? I wonder how much he bet on this Series. Lots of cheaters in the Hall, spitballers, guys who beat up cripples in the stands, etc. I don’t think any pro athlete would be afraid to cheat, especially if he or she is pretty sure they won’t get caught. Especially since so many of them have strong feelings of entitlement, and the religious freaks think God wants them tow in, so whatever they do to help themselves win is ok. Posted 10/20 at 09:12 PM
Bob S said...
I love your snarky blog, and have been a loyal Shyster reader. However, as a former college pitcher, I thought that the Rivera blog was not your best work. First, spitballers don’t actually spit on the ball - they scuff it, put pine tar on it, use vaseline, etc. Second, Rivera’s cutter doesn’t behave like a spitter - it’s too consistent in its break, whereas spitters break in all directions (which is what makes them dangerous to throw, and the reason they were banned). Most serious fans (and I count you among them) should know this. Finally, the video was inconclusive, and was quickly discredited by other video/pictures. Maybe you were just trying to bait Yankee fans, but the blog wasn’t funny, and it wasn’t intelligent. If I wanted that type of writing, I’d read the newspapers! Rivera, given his reputation, deserved better, and today’s blog provided fodder for those in the mainstream media who question the responsibility of bloggers. But was it completely out of line? No, just not good. I expect better from shysterball. Posted 10/20 at 11:13 PM
Kevin said...
Nothing wrong with bringing it up…but I don’t think this was a particularly believable story, not because it was Mariano but because I really don’t think anybody would throw a spitball by spitting on the ball…baseball players spit all the time, and there are way easier ways to put something on the ball. This was a non-story from the start. Posted 10/20 at 11:57 PM
RP said...
I’m someone who rarely makes a substantive comment but regularly throws in some snark. In this case, let me echo the general consensus—Craig, I have no problem with your article. You asked questions that needed to be asked, based on the evidence that was available. You dealt with the issue fairly, and when it was shown that Mo had not cheated, you updated the story. Just because some subset of Yankee fans are inane morons does not mean you’re wrong. Now, if we can back to proving that Jeter and Mo were deeply involved in the ACORN scandals, we’d all be better off for it. Posted 10/21 at 12:50 AM
Kevin S. said...
I heard John Henry offered ACORN his private jet so they could fly employees around for prostitution seminars. Posted 10/21 at 12:58 AM
DSFC said...
Another Yankees fan here, and I also am a big fan of ShysterBall…..that said, I think you overplayed this based on pretty much nothing. The rantings of a poorly written Angels blog is barely noteworthy. Of particular silliness is the notion that Mo was looking around to see if anyone is looking. First of all, as he knows, millions of people are looking. Second of all, by turning away from the plate, he gives all of the umpires save the home plate umpire a better look at what he’s doing. And on top of everything else, has any pitcher since the dead ball era actually spit on the ball? That in itself marks the “theory” as preposterous. Posted 10/21 at 01:18 AM
Michael said...
As far as the “story isn’t believable because players don’t do XYZ,” I can’t believe anyone who’s followed baseball in the ‘00s hasn’t seen that players will try ANYTHING. Posted 10/21 at 03:45 AM
Kepros said...
Craig, I used to work for many years at an alternative newspaper, which despite being ostensibly a newspaper, is often expected to straddle the same infopiniontaintment line as a good blog (yes, that second t is intentional). I know you’re fond of wading into the comment trenches to engage with the worst sort of eggs, and my bosses used to encourage me to do the same, but I could never bring myself to do it. And despite the fact that I respect your lawyerly urge to do so, I can’t help but feel that it probably makes the animosity between you and the bad eggs worse more than it defuses it. I know you like the comment-conversation angle, but have you ever considered leaving the turds to stink unanswered? Posted 10/21 at 04:19 AM
AdrianK said...
Mother Theresa had been known to employ a corked bat, so damage would have likely been minimal, 5 day suspension maximun Posted 10/21 at 09:12 AM
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I’m an Angels fan, and I have a couple of points to make regarding Craig and some of the comments above this.
1. Craig, what you did was fine. I will agree with some of the Yankee fans that you definitely appeared to have a side in this, but this is your blog, you’re allowed to have opinions. Even though I didn’t think, given the evidence that I say, that Rivera spit on the ball, I appreciated your input and opinion.
2. I appreciate your general, “Hey, let’s question the status quo” position. Reputation is certainly relevant, but it’s not enough to dismiss something like this out of hand.
3. For those questioning Halo Heaven - I participate over there and like all team-centric blogs, there are people who are very biased towards the Angels, and ignore logic in their support of the team. One of those people happens to be the guy who runs the site, which is unfortunate, but there are a lot of good commenters in that community. You’ll find the exact same types of people in a Yankees blog (where I’m sure no one questioned the sanctity of Rivera) or a Brewers blog or whatever. Don’t base your opinion of Angels fans on those types of people.