May 23, 2013

Who is Shyster?


Roll mouse over dates
Daily Posts
May 2013
S M T W T F S



1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8 9 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 30 31

Monthly Archives



Or you can search by:

Most Recent Comments

Shyster's Daily Circuit


Baseball. Blogging. Whenever.

Tuesday, October 20, 2009

Did Mariano Rivera throw a spitball?!

Check out the video here. I'll hear all evidence to the contrary, but that looks to me like he (a) looks up to see if anyone is watching; and (b) spits right on the damn ball.

Is that the secret to the unhittable cutter?

UPDATE: The Yankees' bad day in multimedia continues . . .

UPDATE #2: A Q&A on Mariano:

Q: Is Mariano definitely spitting on the ball?

A: Hard to say. Looks like it to me, but the cutaway is quick and the angle could be deceiving. I'm just going with my first impression of what the video and photo show. I'd kill for another angle of this.

Q: Do you actually throw a spitball by, you know, spitting on the ball?

A: It's not the most traditional way -- according to everything I've read merely wetting the fingers is more common -- but it's certainly been done. Really, anything that either (a) adds a viscous fluid to the ball to alter its flight; or (b) lubes it up to decrease friction upon release, thereby increasing the spin and thus the ultimate drop is sufficient.

Q: If it is a spitball, why would Rivera be so obvious about it? He's a smart guy. He'd try to hide it better, wouldn't he?

A: Maybe so. But isn't it just as valid to say that Rivera, one of the most talented pitchers ever, never had to use a spitball before, and thus if he is now, he's less likely to be practiced at it than a guy who had to cheat just to keep his job?

I have no idea what he's doing here -- and I simply don't want to believe that Rivera was throwing a spitter, because I've always admired and respected the guy -- but it doesn't seem satisfying to simply say "Mariano would never do this, so he didn't do it." The video is very, very interesting. It may be completely debunked by another angle -- and if anyone has one, please send it ASAP and I'll update. But for now, it's all we have.

I know I have a reputation for baiting Yankees fans, but I am sincere in asking whether or not Rivera was doing this. I don't know, and I'm open to alternate interpretations and evidence.




(thanks to Jason Epstein for the heads up)



Posted by Craig Calcaterra at 8:45am


Comments

MJ said...

I’m going with not cheating just because, jeezum, he knows how many cameras are trained on him at any given moment in and out of the game and this is just so blatant. He can’t be that dumb. He can’t be that… absentminded. No way.

A lot of people keep bringing this up, but doesn’t this argument fall flat on its’ face considering we don’t have one conclusive shot of whether he did or didn’t?  How can you say we’d know for sure that he did if he did, since we can’t even get a good look at the ball now?

The exception to this rule (IMO)is that really idiotic commentors that are anti-Yankee or anti-Red Sox do not get the same tar and feathering.

I’m doing my best over there, but the Church of the Perpetually Outraged has been busy, and the level of idiocy in the comments section is becoming nuclear :(

Posted 10/20  at  01:30 PM
scatterbrian said...

Beanster:

Is there another human activity where standing around wearing a cup is normal?

Posted 10/20  at  01:31 PM
ta192 said...

Photo of Arod groping Jeter is the funniest thing I’ve seen in years…many thanx, Craig…

Posted 10/20  at  02:08 PM
SomeCallMe...Tim said...

That is one magic loogie. There must be a second spitter. Probably Roger McDowell behind the bushes on the gravelly road.

Posted 10/20  at  02:55 PM
yogi berra said...

It’s the Yankee way to cheat.

Posted 10/20  at  03:00 PM
Mike Fast said...

@Craig, re the Baseball Reference description of the two types of spitballs.  Mariano surely does not use the second kind of spitball.  Lubricating the fingers to release what looks like a fastball but doesn’t spin as hard or get the extra several mph of oomph from the fingertips snapping basically produces a low-rotation splitter/changeup type of pitch.  Mariano doesn’t throw such a pitch and hasn’t in all the pitches that were recorded by PITCHf/x in 2008 and 2009.

The other type of spitball (glob of spit on the side of the ball to make the pitch break in that direction) might produce more of a cutter action, in line with Mariano’s actual stuff.  However, the simpler explanation is that his unique grip on the ball is sufficient to explain the movement on his cutter.  He grips the ball a little off center like most pitchers do with their cutter, but the way he’s got his fingers on the seam and the snap he gets from that is what gives his cutter such spin.  You can see pictures here:
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/blog_article/what-should-we-call-riveras-other-fastball/

I don’t think we need to resort to spitballs as an explanation for his stuff.  His stuff is good; his command of it is better.  It adds up to an outstanding pitcher.

Posted 10/20  at  04:21 PM
yogi berra said...

Thanks for the explanation, Professor Steinbrenner.

Posted 10/20  at  04:27 PM
Mo didn't Cheat said...

1.) Spitting on a ball is not the way you throw a spit ball; you use petroleum jelly… spit isn’t strong enough to actually make an impact on the movement of the pitch.
2.) There were 3 umpires and a full stadium watching him at the time, and we are supposed to believe everybody just happened to miss Mo hocking on the ball?
3.) Photographs from the moment prove that Mo did in fact spit, but his spit traveled past the baseball, to the mound.

The only reason anybody is even talking about this stuff is because Angels fans are upset, people generally dislike the Yankees, and people envy Mo.

Posted 10/20  at  11:58 PM
Wells said...

The only reason anybody is even talking about this stuff is because Angels fans are upset, people generally dislike the Yankees, and people envy Mo.

And the Angels are playing absolutely horribly.

Posted 10/21  at  12:02 AM
yogi berra said...

The reason people are posting is because it’s true, open your eyes, this is not film manipulation.
Stop thinking the world is against the Yankees,it’s not, they’re the most popular team, i know i was on the team in the 50’s/60’s, at least none of my teammates weren’t swapping spit like Derek & ARod back then.

Posted 10/21  at  12:27 AM
Page 3 of 3  <  1 2 3

Commenting is not available in this weblog entry.

     Next Post:  MLB: No evidence Rivera was throwing a spitter>> <<Previous Post:  And That Happened: LCS Edition